logo
Welcome Guest! To enable all features please Login or Register.

Notification

Icon
Error
EU regulation: "uncertainty in the regulatory environment" - richard
Options View Go to last post Go to first unread
Previous Topic Next Topic
richard
#1 Posted : 03 February 2013 11:45:16(UTC)
Richard

Rank: Administration

Groups: Registered, Administrators
Joined: 16/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 3,358
United Kingdom
Location: Bradford

Thanks: 113 times
Was thanked: 342 time(s) in 284 post(s)
In the days when newspapers had specialist agriculture correspondents, the news the German chemicals giant BASF had dropped attempts to market genetically modified potato varieties in Europe might have merited more than a passing reference in an obscure corner of the BBC website, under a trivialising headline.

And had such correspondents been active, and those self-same newspapers still took any interest at all in agriculture, more than just the Guardian might have reported on the Oxford Farming Conference back in early January, a political highlight of the farming year which used to be widely reported in the popular media.

With the two events in the public domain, one or other of the correspondents – having the time and background knowledge to explore such things – might have linked the two reports and noticed a startling incongruity which has profound implications for the current (albeit lacklustre) debate on the European Union.

View full article here
Back to top
WWW
mmatis
#2 Posted : 03 February 2013 13:24:16(UTC)
mmatis

Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 17/07/2012(UTC)
Posts: 462
Man
United States
Location: Cocoa, Florida

Thanks: 92 times
Was thanked: 36 time(s) in 27 post(s)
So would this perchance be one of three areas of failure in EU policy/regulation that might provide a base for showing the teeming masses the difference between what is and what could be? Or are your Media and "leaders" so overwhelmingly against "any" form of GM that you could never take this message forward as a starter?

Of course, those against GM ignore the fact that ALL selective breeding, whether of flora or of fauna, is merely another form of GM. But then that's a topic for another day...
Back to top
Ravenscar
#3 Posted : 03 February 2013 13:46:42(UTC)
Ravenscar

Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 17/07/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,016
Location: The North

Thanks: 124 times
Was thanked: 150 time(s) in 100 post(s)
Ethics, IG Farben and BASF - discuss.


I can't argue the logic of growing genetically mutated[modified, mutated whatever] food, on the other hand, I cannot be but highly suspicious of - the 'benefits' to mother nature.

But head must rule the heart....

I want to believe in the benefits of GM food, the food problems in poorer countries are great but not insurmountable and I like the idea of using less fertiliser and pesticides through the cultivation of GM crops - in agriculturally advanced nations. Further and anyway, it could be said that we are killing off the environment through overuse of agri-chemicals.

GM why not, we should be investigating and experimenting - because it would be idiocy not to.

But not with BASF.

On the EU and BASF, we see the power environmental lobby wielded and the sheer convoluted rottenness of the grand projet at its most idiotic.

On Biofuels, on energy policy the idiots hold sway - why would it be any different with GM crops?

Edited by user 03 February 2013 13:54:47(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified
Back to top
Ravenscar
#4 Posted : 03 February 2013 14:01:25(UTC)
Ravenscar

Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 17/07/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,016
Location: The North

Thanks: 124 times
Was thanked: 150 time(s) in 100 post(s)
I was talking about EU contradictions illustrate the extreme idiocy of all that the EU is and arse about face sums it up.

Quote:

Today we report that MEPs have paved the way for millions of pounds to be poured into tobacco farms in Bulgaria and other EU countries. We don’t blame tobacco farmers for trying to squeeze everything they can from the EU’s hugely generous system of agricultural support: they are only doing what farmers of all kinds in every EU country do, which is to lobby for their own interests and ensure that they are rewarded with as much money as possible from the collective kitty.

What is puzzling is that the EU’s representatives should even be considering reintroducing financial support for the growing of tobacco, which was withdrawn in 2004.


So, UK taxpayers money to fund Tobacco and taxpayers money used to fund anti smoking campaigns here in Britain and no doubt across the EU.

Thinking - joined up?

I rather think not.
Back to top
TheBoilingFrog
#5 Posted : 03 February 2013 14:03:49(UTC)
TheBoilingFrog

Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 17/07/2012(UTC)
Posts: 414
United Kingdom
Location: Didcot

Thanks: 28 times
Was thanked: 29 time(s) in 26 post(s)
I remember when working for Bayer (a company not unconnected with BASF) they had this problem nearly 10 years ago:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/3584763.stm
Back to top
WWW
richard
#6 Posted : 03 February 2013 14:24:20(UTC)
Richard

Rank: Administration

Groups: Registered, Administrators
Joined: 16/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 3,358
United Kingdom
Location: Bradford

Thanks: 113 times
Was thanked: 342 time(s) in 284 post(s)
Originally Posted by: Ravenscar Go to Quoted Post
I was talking about EU contradictions illustrate the extreme idiocy of all that the EU is and arse about face sums it up.

Quote:

Today we report that MEPs have paved the way for millions of pounds to be poured into tobacco farms in Bulgaria and other EU countries. We don’t blame tobacco farmers for trying to squeeze everything they can from the EU’s hugely generous system of agricultural support: they are only doing what farmers of all kinds in every EU country do, which is to lobby for their own interests and ensure that they are rewarded with as much money as possible from the collective kitty.

What is puzzling is that the EU’s representatives should even be considering reintroducing financial support for the growing of tobacco, which was withdrawn in 2004.


So, UK taxpayers money to fund Tobacco and taxpayers money used to fund anti smoking campaigns here in Britain and no doubt across the EU.

Thinking - joined up?

I rather think not.


Now go back and read the story properly, viz: ".... But the good times, thanks to the political machinations of MEPs in Brussels more than 1,300 miles away, may just be about to roll again".

In other words, it is based on the crappy story Gilligan did last week ...

http://www.eureferendum.com/blogview.aspx?blogno=83566

The EP committee have approved an amendment to the Commission proposal which allows for subsidies (which is not a value judgement ... simply it managed to pass the procedural test).

In other words, the story is a load of bollox, with absolutely no substance, based on a complete misunderstanding of EP procedural rules.



.

Edited by user 03 February 2013 15:47:29(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified
Back to top
WWW
flyinthesky
#7 Posted : 03 February 2013 16:02:18(UTC)
flyinthesky

Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 25/11/2012(UTC)
Posts: 107
United Kingdom
Location: Lancashire

Thanks: 70 times
Was thanked: 10 time(s) in 9 post(s)
As an aside, GM is about monetising and cartelising agribusiness and very little to do with feeding or benefiting the world.
Back to top
richard
#8 Posted : 03 February 2013 16:36:36(UTC)
Richard

Rank: Administration

Groups: Registered, Administrators
Joined: 16/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 3,358
United Kingdom
Location: Bradford

Thanks: 113 times
Was thanked: 342 time(s) in 284 post(s)
Originally Posted by: flyinthesky Go to Quoted Post
As an aside, GM is about monetising and cartelising agribusiness and very little to do with feeding or benefiting the world.




You are right with this one. This particular variety is not a food product. It is used for producing industrial starch. However, is less acreage is needed for starch production, one assumes that land is released for other purposes, one of which might be food production.
Back to top
WWW
Dave Evans
#9 Posted : 03 February 2013 16:54:32(UTC)
Dave Evans

Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 17/07/2012(UTC)
Posts: 366
United Kingdom
Location: Peterlee

Thanks: 15 times
Was thanked: 24 time(s) in 22 post(s)
My problem with GM crops is more to do with patenting of strains.

There have already been cases where farmers have been sued because their crops have been cross-pollinated with GM crops, not something they really have a lot of control over.

Yes I know that a lot of GM crops are designed sterile too.

Edited by user 03 February 2013 16:55:27(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified
Back to top
flyinthesky
#10 Posted : 03 February 2013 17:26:01(UTC)
flyinthesky

Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 25/11/2012(UTC)
Posts: 107
United Kingdom
Location: Lancashire

Thanks: 70 times
Was thanked: 10 time(s) in 9 post(s)
Originally Posted by: richard Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: flyinthesky Go to Quoted Post
As an aside, GM is about monetising and cartelising agribusiness and very little to do with feeding or benefiting the world.




You are right with this one. This particular variety is not a food product. It is used for producing industrial starch. However, is less acreage is needed for starch production, one assumes that land is released for other purposes, one of which might be food production.


I think I'm right with 99% of GM, most of the research is profit and cartel motivated not altruistic intent, call me a luddite if you will. This one has the greatest potential to "really" bite us in the ass.
Back to top
richard
#11 Posted : 03 February 2013 17:26:26(UTC)
Richard

Rank: Administration

Groups: Registered, Administrators
Joined: 16/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 3,358
United Kingdom
Location: Bradford

Thanks: 113 times
Was thanked: 342 time(s) in 284 post(s)
Originally Posted by: Dave Evans Go to Quoted Post
My problem with GM crops is more to do with patenting of strains.

There have already been cases where farmers have been sued because their crops have been cross-pollinated with GM crops, not something they really have a lot of control over.

Yes I know that a lot of GM crops are designed sterile too.




I have heaps of problems with GM. But here, that isn't the central issue. The question is, who decides? The British government or the EU?
Back to top
WWW
flyinthesky
#12 Posted : 03 February 2013 17:28:54(UTC)
flyinthesky

Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 25/11/2012(UTC)
Posts: 107
United Kingdom
Location: Lancashire

Thanks: 70 times
Was thanked: 10 time(s) in 9 post(s)
Originally Posted by: Dave Evans Go to Quoted Post
My problem with GM crops is more to do with patenting of strains.

There have already been cases where farmers have been sued because their crops have been cross-pollinated with GM crops, not something they really have a lot of control over.

Yes I know that a lot of GM crops are designed sterile too.


This is the intended destination, no GM seed, no crop.
Back to top
flyinthesky
#13 Posted : 03 February 2013 17:50:34(UTC)
flyinthesky

Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 25/11/2012(UTC)
Posts: 107
United Kingdom
Location: Lancashire

Thanks: 70 times
Was thanked: 10 time(s) in 9 post(s)
Originally Posted by: richard Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Dave Evans Go to Quoted Post
My problem with GM crops is more to do with patenting of strains.

There have already been cases where farmers have been sued because their crops have been cross-pollinated with GM crops, not something they really have a lot of control over.

Yes I know that a lot of GM crops are designed sterile too.




I have heaps of problems with GM. But here, that isn't the central issue. The question is, who decides? The British government or the EU?



I think it's beyond either. Obviously it should be the British government as that's what the thread's about but they're for sale as the eu and the UN are. This could actually be the end game.
It's right up there with AGW except you could turn that off. GM could take on a mind and intention of its own.
Back to top
Ravenscar
#14 Posted : 04 February 2013 00:12:23(UTC)
Ravenscar

Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Registered
Joined: 17/07/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1,016
Location: The North

Thanks: 124 times
Was thanked: 150 time(s) in 100 post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by: Ravenscar Go to Quoted Post
I was talking about EU contradictions illustrate the extreme idiocy of all that the EU is and arse about face sums it up.

Quote:

Today we report that MEPs have paved the way for millions of pounds to be poured into tobacco farms in Bulgaria and other EU countries. We don’t blame tobacco farmers for trying to squeeze everything they can from the EU’s hugely generous system of agricultural support: they are only doing what farmers of all kinds in every EU country do, which is to lobby for their own interests and ensure that they are rewarded with as much money as possible from the collective kitty.

What is puzzling is that the EU’s representatives should even be considering reintroducing financial support for the growing of tobacco, which was withdrawn in 2004.


So, UK taxpayers money to fund Tobacco and taxpayers money used to fund anti smoking campaigns here in Britain and no doubt across the EU.

Thinking - joined up?

I rather think not.


Now go back and read the story properly, viz: ".... But the good times, thanks to the political machinations of MEPs in Brussels more than 1,300 miles away, may just be about to roll again".

In other words, it is based on the crappy story Gilligan did last week ...

http://www.eureferendum....ogview.aspx?blogno=83566

The EP committee have approved an amendment to the Commission proposal which allows for subsidies (which is not a value judgement ... simply it managed to pass the procedural test).

In other words, the story is a load of bollox, with absolutely no substance, based on a complete misunderstanding of EP procedural rules.


Blushing Blushing apologies................ a thousand apologies................................Richard.

Edited by user 04 February 2013 09:59:18(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified
Back to top
Users browsing this topic
Guest
Forum Jump  
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.

Powered by YAF 1.9.6.1 | YAF © 2003-2013, Yet Another Forum.NET
This page was generated in 0.319 seconds.