The figures are slightly heartening, however really they do not add up to a hill of beans.

I was talking to a cousin, who lives over in Erin. He regaled me of some stories about the 'stay in EU juggernaut' and he explained that the forces [UK side] that would be mobilised in the 'in' camp would be formidable, truly formidable.

But and but and But - David lined up against a giant and his aim was true. Albion, we have been here before and stuffed the Corsican megalomaniac and held the line against the Barmy Austrian corporal as well - by comparison, it should be a cake walk.

Edited by user 27 December 2012 01:13:59(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

You can see though that the europhiles are beginning to marshal their forces - the Guardian is running a series on the EU with week, and others will follow. The forces of darkness have years to crank up their propaganda machine. We have nothing comparable.

I happen to disagree.

One tends to forget that TPTB are the same one's that have brought us to the point at which we now stand. Who is to say whether they wish us to go further or not. Actions, or inactions as one might suggest, prove more important than mere words. If the so called TPTB want what is best for the people, which is not the same as the 'National Interest' which they keep saying, then they will act according to our general wish, and let us have our say. To date, that has NEVER happened.

They have lied and obfuscated right from the very start and, they show no intent of changing.

The EU-Project moves at a tectonic pace. Once in a while pressure builds up in the system, such as with the faults with Euro, until something gives. Then there is a sudden jolt and the call for more powers for the centre along with the inevitable treaty change.

The trouble is, that this time they need to move to the next stage. That next stage simply cannot be hidden for what it truly is, a Federal Europe.

That is why comments like we have been hearing for the past year of, "Britain being left behind," and "Britain must remain in the EU" are being made. Alternatives to EU membership, such as EEA/EFTA ignored or rubbished.

Lack of any good information on things EU from the MSM means the general public do not have the necessary information to make an informed decision, on a matter that has real implications to their lives.

Cameron's job is to keep the UK at the EU dinner table, no matter what. We may be siting at the end and on the naughty chair, with little too say over the choice of menu. But we will still be asked to pay for most of the meal at the end. And when the time comes, the TPTB will allow us to have 'our say', but on their terms and when the 'right result' can be assured.

As I have said in a previous post. What does voting IN actually mean ? And if we vote IN what safeguards are there against joining the Euro. That last one is still VERY much an option !

We have the EU itself. Hollande's remark about not having Europe a la carte nails the lie about renegotiation. It has to be in or out with in being a full membership in the long term. They cannot lie about this and hope to get away with it this time. After the German elections in 2013 it will be full steam ahead for economic and monetary union for the 17 with the outsiders on the outside. We know what is coming. Even the MSM will have to explain what the Euro core is doing. We will be in the outer core of Europe but run by Europe. Not a good thing to sell to an increasingly sceptical public, when the alternative is 'give us back our country'.

Comet said



None of the TBTB can contemplate leaving, so they will never make a decision, they will be dragged their kicking and screaming, while comeing up with more and more ridiculous alternatives and scare stories.

They are passengers from now on.

I have come to the conclusion that the main reason the TPTB love the EU, is because we have such low rent venal scumbags in westminster, such as Yeo, it represents very easy pickings....,

I suspect you will find that, if you are confident of a win, you won't get a referendum...

The interesting question is, "What's driving euroscepticism?". I mean by that those saying what their intentions would be in a referendum; the 36% wanting out, the 15% tempted to get out and the 18% not confident that staying in is the right decision.

I doubt the answer is along the lines that it's a fundamentally dangerous and anti-democratic utopian experiment which is bound to fail and cause endless misery. Shallow economic arguments are worth nothing because this has always been political in nature, but it knew it could not declare its case openly, so has sought to advance itself by deception.


The travails of the Euro show that it's failing.

We've been lied to and generally don't trust the current crop of politicians one iota. If they are keen, that's a good reason not to be; a general dissatisfaction with the state of things in the UK projected onto the EU.

It's the Fourth Reich and our grandparents didn't lay down their lives for that.

It's the EUSSR and we saw where the USSR ended up.

If it isn't a French thing, it's a German thing, and now we've reached the incredible situation where they are ganging up on us rather than wasting their energies fighting each other, as is the natural order of things.

It's gone too far, we only signed up for a trade agreement, and we were assured we wouldn't be dictated to. Now we have prisoners' votes and gay marriage.

We don't like being ruled by a lot of nasty foreigners, especially Van Rompuy and that Ashton woman. If she isn't foreign, she ought to be.

It's an idea that's had its day.

Allowing huge numbers of Eastern European immigrants, with the prospect of more, is no way to run the country.

Another one which is yet to come is that the EU has closed down the working power stations and plastered the country with windmills thereby causing death and misery to millions and unjustly further enriching those with already full pockets.

I don't think that euroscepticism as in these polls is hard, but it's hardening.