I would say, imho the prob' is not what the destination is, our destiny is freedom and out of the slave Empire of doom, the argument is over the method of travel.................

and us lot 'ere - we know where the key to the lock is - oh yes indeedy!


Flippin 'eck if Dave has actually acknowledged the out thingy then the game really is afoot.


Furthermore, it begs the question......................[how in hell's name] has somebody finally ...... some sense into the Eton toff at long last and hells teeth - it is certainly about flippin' time.

The state of our politics is one of those things: just when you think it can't get any worse, it does. I thought we couldn't sink lower than Bliar and Broon -- and then we got this pathetic Prime Maggot. And millipede is all the future has in store.

Whatever is the matter with the British?

The words from the DT and the FT are the same. This is a plant from No 10, a continuation of the dance of the seven veils from Dave. Kill the lie about renegotiation of powers and there is no way to go other than an in out referendum with the options being more Europe or no Europe.

They are seriously scared and are starting to flounder.

Cameron HAS to acknowledge the fact if he is to address the public dislike of all things EU, which does have a head of steam about it.He has to "reach out" and that starts with faux sympathy and understanding,so he can then allay all our fears with his worthless renegotiation option.Fortunately no one believes a word a politician says anymore.

The greater worry is the big business view and the hopeless coverage our media are giving us which could well make some voters wobble.

The other big factor is the EU itself, as it morphs into a European superstate.The colleagues just cannot hide that anymore.The days when the EU was viewed here as some slightly eccentric institute over the water, that only occasionally made the headlines is gone.The more folk realise this is no longer going to be a loose union of member states the more our chances of getting out.

So how do we get a simple comprehensive understanding of invoking "article 50" out there to a wider mainstream audience? that is the question:

Booker reaches a particular wider audience by virtue of the fact he is MSM and although his articles are sound, factual and excoriating at times there simply isn't enough of a 'what if we invoke article 50' and show the consequences of such i.e. nothing changes the day after, from him and other mainstream journalists to reach enough people. Throw in the ineptitude of Farage and his ECA 1973 repealers and the waters become ever so muddy.

No matter what one thinks of Farage and his ilk the cry of 'repeal ECA 1973' and all will be well is a simple soundbite that to people who want 'out' but do not understand the nuances and complexities of the EU are likely to latch onto, after all most of us do make simple choices in life, yes I want it no I dont, yes I will renew my contract for my phone or whatever or no I wont.

I'd like to see more articles one after the other from Booker Delingpole etc (being pragmatic I know I can't influence their agenda) where they focus specifically on article 50 and use example after example from business, energy, fisheries, HSE, in fact all the competencies that the EU control and compare before and after article 50 showing the power of such a decision to raise greater awareness.

maybe I'm asking for too much but beyond blogs like this one and others who hanner home the same message its back to my original question "do we get a simple comprehensive understanding of invoking "article 50" out there to a wider mainstream audience?"

just asking

What Ashcroft’s poll suggests is that with the rise of a political class party labels become brands of basically the same product. This can be sustained only as long as first the electorate broadly agree with the cultural values of that political class or they are not given an alternative.
Labour was able to neutralise the BNP as an alternative for the white manual working class but the Conservatives can’t really deal with Ukip in the same way.
Even if a fractured Conservative party leads to a pro-EU Labour-LibDem coalition having a large section of the population disaffected and feeling increasingly aggrieved will fuel English nationalism.
Our political class see politics as a branch of marketing so will be game playing how to sell the EU to the public rather than accept the cultural incompatibility that is driving disaffection.
It is all about the ratchet approach: they simply do not understand that no policies or alliances are forever. The EU is, far as the UK is concerned, last century.

BNP, because of the name, was easy to taint with the racist slur and Griffin didn't help. Otherwise I think it could have taken off.

Not so sure about this one, Yeah a flat tax rate is a very good idea, but i think the merging of Income tax and NI will open up a minefield.

NI is used to calculate a lot of things, pensions. benefits entitlement etc. Also there are people who pay income tax but dont pay NI (for example pentioners), if the two taxes were merged then would pentioners have to "pay it again"even though they have spent their lives paying it.

The Merging the two sounds good and all, but when you think about it, there is a lot more explaining of how required from UKIP

As far as the Conservative Party is concerned Ashcroft is part of the problem rather than the solution. Ashcroftsjust written another article justifying his own vote losing, membership crumbling strategies.

eg The EU is very complikated subject and the voters aren't interested anyway. So no need for an in-out referendum.

UKIP "seem to want to take Britain back to a time when things were done more sensibly". So forward the Tory modernisers. Gay marriage for all !There is no alternative. The lady's not for turning.


And so goodnight, goodbye and good riddance to the Tory Party.




Now this is a good point. UKIP really need to concentrate on producing some policies that will stand up to scrutiny.

Take the commitment to increasing defence spending by 40%.

1, Where is the money coming from to do this?
2, Why ? Who do we need to protect ourselves from anyway?
3, Where are all these new recruits coming from? The military struggle to fill the places at the moment.

UKIP need to project a professional, managerial outlook and the current manifesto doesn't cut it.

Edited by user 18 December 2012 12:32:20(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Do you really think the bulk of the electorate know the main policies of the parties? Most will just vote on a general “feel” unless they are one of the “...my father before me voted Labour/Conservative so...” How did the Welsh and Scottish nationalist break the mould? It was not with detailed costed policies. The only difference is Ukip will be subject to detailed analyses by the MSM particularly the Guardian-BBC but then unless it is slipped into Reality TV it will probably go unnoticed, like the Party Political Broadcasts.