It seems it's retrospective day, for the BBC, this time producing and article on the 20th anniversary of the Swiss rejection in a referendum of membership of the European Economic Area by "the tiniest of margins".

The BBC positions this membership as "the first step towards full membership of the European Union". Had it joined the EEA, by now, it says, "Switzerland would probably be one of the more longstanding members of the EU".

The article is worth reading in full, but what is interesting is the way the EEA is seen as a halfway house to EU membership. Yet this very same organisation we see as a parking place for the UK, should we leave the EU.

View full article here

Dr North

I will be grateful if you would confirm a point for me. As I understand Article 50, should the people of the 'United' Kingdom express, by one means or another, their wish to leave the EU negotiations to that end would be triggered by a 'U'K government application to leave. Should the negotiations prove fruitless the 'U'K will cease to be a member state of the EU two years after the date on which talks were started. Am I correct?

Sadly we are no longer in a position to defend ourselves, let alone small European nations. Were that not the case I'd advocate defending Swiss neutrality, particularly since the Germans seem to have a tendency to site POW camps within striking distance of the Swiss border.


Once upon a time 'the repatriation of powers' would have been the stuff of chip wrappers, being only a fiction retailed by the 'U'K media and the political class that feeds from its manifold tits. History has shown, again and again and again, that powers surrendered are rarely regained, except at very considerable cost and much loss of life. Power is enforceable will, whether militarily, politically, socially, intellectually or economically, not some obscure moot point of alleged principle. I'm sure that the Eurozone will collapse before the 'U'K is able to extract itself from the EU. Partly because I'm just as sure that the average 'U'K voter is unable to think much further than the end of the week and is more concerned with the reality of TV than the boring trivialities of ultra long-term politics, if I may coin a phrase, although I'm sure I haven't, and partly because, really, I suspect - having no deep knowledge of parasitic organisms, the EU doesn't really want us out; it wants us in, somewhere cold and dark and useless.

I know nothing of the machinations of the EU (I rely on the good doctor) but, like the working man with a taste for wine, I know I don't like it.

Nirvana + Amen to that!

IMHO; out and free, interim - EEA yes but with none of Brussels sprouting mash.

______________________________________________________________________________________


The book of unaccountable sore points number 39,000,001 = why we must leave this disgustingly corrupt empire - ramshackle and too bloody big for our and its own good.

In 'the Thunderer', dated: Thurs' Dec 6th 2012.

Opinion pages.


"We need to know if £500m of NHS money was wasted" byline Ben Goldacre.

In synopsis [I'm knackered], the Tamiflu laboratory tests results have not been completely revealed. In 2005 Labour spent £500m stockpiling Tamiflu to combat [global warming?] er swine flu.



writes Ben.

This is down to Roche getting away with murder in a metaphorical sense because the rools are dictated by another shady set of twats, namely the grandly titled 'EUROPEAN MEDICINES AGENCY'.

Ben goes on to say:



No shi7.

Get us out and NOW!

Edited by user 07 December 2012 00:56:13(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

I have plans for altering the sidebar over Christmas ... where the "manifesto" and other stuff is. All that needs updating, and now the website is stable, I can start attending to the detail.

On the immigration debate link,the Immigration minister, Mark Harper, when questioned on potential EU immigration estimates from Bulgaria and Romania............



Never stopped them before

Well once the borders are open to these two states we can expect a lot more of this

http://www.dailymail.co....say-Slovak-parents.html.

Rotherham social workers will be rubbing their hands at all the extra overtime coming their way.Not to mention lawyers,police,judges and court officials.

Fortunately we soon will have the arrival of the "balance of competences review" which will expose the problem for all to see....oh er wait.....the government doesn't do estimates on those figures...so how accurate is the competence review going to be then?If they ever run out of loo roll in the HOC they will have something to hand as a back up.

Edited by user 07 December 2012 11:00:49(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

My question was concerning the formalities of these organisations. I agree, the Westphalian model of sovereignty is under explicit attack.

I don’t buy into the “ EU will collapse and everything will be OK” meme. The nightmare scenario is economic collapse (probably piece-wise, not a single event) with the political system including the UK’s entanglement remaining intact. In the absence of effective political challenges to the system, which are currently negligible, this IMO is the default outcome.

I don’t think the intention is to shed tears for the Swiss. It’s to understand how what they are doing works for them/doesn’t work for them, and how that understanding might be useful for the UK.

Thanks, but hey – none required. ( I know my style can be a bit succinct )

Edited by user 07 December 2012 11:50:51(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Thinking aloud ...
Widely reported that the EUssr have in fact told Salmond that a newly-independent-of-the-UK Scotland would have to re-apply for membership of the EU. The implication being that the new terms will not be particularly favourable to the Scots.

So I wonder ... What would happen of the English had a referendum and voted to leave the United Kingdom?

I can't think of a downside; is there one?

But economic collapse is also likely to trigger the forces of nationalism, as we've seen before. The EU is largely an attempt to defuse those forces. Ill considered expansion was always going to be an Achilles' Heel. Had the EU and the Euro been less ambitious and reckless the problems it faces now would have been at least less severe.

I think what we are seeing is another crisis in statism, corporatism or whatever you call it; the big state run by wise ones, who've neutralised democratic feedback, not being very good at doing anything and the wise ones not turning out to be so wise. We've seen it before with the experiments with communism in the 20th century, which actually weren't communism or the dictatorship of the proletariat. You could say that in chaos, those who are organised are most likely to take charge and prevail, but the EU isn't very good at using force, it's always been about making life easy for politicians and bureaucrats, and that assumes a background of stability.

My nightmare is that the EU breaks up and the UK continues as the last outpost. The EU mentality is deeply ingrained in the UK establishment.

As far as I can see the Colleagues are trying to force Switzerland into a mould they are thanking their lucky stars for avoiding. They can apply pressure, but the Swiss system allows for the bloody mindedness of the Swiss people to express itself. Presumably, the goal is to get Switzerland to join in financing Club Med and relieving the strain on Germany.



I can see that, but there's a difference between a country which never got in and dealt with the EU when it was less well developed and more tractable, and the UK which has been sucked in and is left extracting itself from the mire.

In both cases, there's no pretending the EU doesn't exist or can simply be dictated to rather than negotiated with. The Swiss are very different to the British in all sorts of ways,