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EU politics: a budget crisis
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richard
#1 Posted : 14 November 2012 13:02:10(UTC)
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Not that you would know it from the legacy media, but the EU is in crisis. That the budget conciliation process has collapsed and the deadline has expired (last night – and they didn't even talk) means that the EU annual budget proposal falls and the Commission must submit a new one, starting the negotiations all over again.

From memory, I think this has only happened twice before, and it is a huge blow to a political construct which prides itself on its negotiation skills and its ability to divine a consensus. More seriously, it means that the Commission does not have the funding to meet existing commitments and, since it is not permitted to borrow and is required to balance its budget, this is rather a serious crisis.

What is, therefore, rather remarkable is the paucity of reporting in the British media, and a certain amount of confusion with the multi-annual budget negotiations, which are a separate issue.

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Dave Evans
#2 Posted : 14 November 2012 14:26:36(UTC)
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Assuming you'll not contest the idea that the EU is a transnational socialist construct, could it be that the socialist unions are in on it & the strikes are a diversionary tactic? Or is that too conspiratorial?
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ChiefyinDurham
#3 Posted : 14 November 2012 14:36:49(UTC)
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Please let this now be the run-in to the final collapse...
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TheBoilingFrog
#4 Posted : 14 November 2012 14:47:34(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Dave Evans Go to Quoted Post
Assuming you'll not contest the idea that the EU is a transnational socialist construct, could it be that the socialist unions are in on it & the strikes are a diversionary tactic? Or is that too conspiratorial?


They're not that clever...it would be to merit them with praise they don't deserve.


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permex
#5 Posted : 14 November 2012 15:05:35(UTC)
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I was taught in school (RC) that damnation in Hell is eternal....seems they may have been right. I see no end in sight.
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Mark B
#6 Posted : 14 November 2012 15:31:45(UTC)
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Let me try and get this right. If they do not agree on the EU annual budget then they go back to last years budget ??

If so, what are the long term implications of this?. I mean, if they cannot agree now, then they are unlikely to agree in the near future, and if the money has already been spent and no borrowing is allowed, what then.

I am beginning to slowly understand this. But what impact is it likely to have on the UK, if any ?

BTW Welcome back Dr. North.
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Peter Mauley
#7 Posted : 14 November 2012 15:56:27(UTC)
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I thought there was a process that accommodated this, i.e. if there was no agreement, the budget went up, by inflation plus two as I recollect. Please put me straight if this is not correct.
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F U Fed Up
#8 Posted : 14 November 2012 15:57:08(UTC)
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To be fair to the hacks....can't think why i should be but....the EU is now in permanent crisis everywhere. So what is one more crisis. How can one keep up with each new crisis, especially as they haven't solved any of the other crises.

They have crisis meetings every day to solve some crisis or other, then announce they haven't solved that one either.

Everything Everywhere a Crisis.
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J A King
#9 Posted : 14 November 2012 17:20:51(UTC)
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Why are there 2 different budgets, an annual and a multi annual? I dont get it.
The only thing the multi annual one can be used for is to set the annual one, so if its been agreed in the multi annual one, then why would they discuss the annual?

Unless we have to pay into 2 different budgets?

I am really lost here, sorry if i am a little thick, but I really am lost.
any help with this most appreciated
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Panda
#10 Posted : 14 November 2012 18:34:02(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: J A King Go to Quoted Post
Why are there 2 different budgets, an annual and a multi annual? I dont get it.
The only thing the multi annual one can be used for is to set the annual one, so if its been agreed in the multi annual one, then why would they discuss the annual?

Unless we have to pay into 2 different budgets?

I am really lost here, sorry if i am a little thick, but I really am lost.
any help with this most appreciated


Right. I will take the plunge and stick my neck out here, no doubt I will be corrected.

The budget for 2012 is €9bn short. They want this making up

The proposal for 2013 is a 6.8% rise

The proposal for 2014--2020 is a 5% rise year on year for 7 years.

I presume you know Cameron's position on all this. I just wonder if he does.
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richard
#11 Posted : 14 November 2012 19:14:03(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: J A King Go to Quoted Post
Why are there 2 different budgets, an annual and a multi annual? I dont get it.
The only thing the multi annual one can be used for is to set the annual one, so if its been agreed in the multi annual one, then why would they discuss the annual?

Unless we have to pay into 2 different budgets?

I am really lost here, sorry if i am a little thick, but I really am lost.
any help with this most appreciated



Currently, the annual budget of 2013 is being negotiated, which includes a supplement for excess spending in 2012.

Separately, we have the 7-year multi-annual negotiations for 2014-202 ... the relationship is set out here:

"Annual EU budgets shall comply with the multiannual financial framework laid down in a unanimously adopted Council Regulation with a consent of the European Parliament. The financial framework sets the maximum amount of commitment appropriations in the EU budget each year for broad policy areas ("headings") and fixes an overall annual ceiling on payment and commitment appropriations."

Thus, the multi-annual framework agreement sets out the maximum figure, but each year the actual figure then has to be negotiated.


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 2 users thanked richard for this useful post.
TheBoilingFrog on 14/11/2012(UTC), J A King on 15/11/2012(UTC)
mmatis
#12 Posted : 14 November 2012 20:34:07(UTC)
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You say:
Quote:
"They have a crisis on their hands and they don't know how to report it."

I would posit that they are "reporting" it EXACTLY as their Betters in Brussels want them to. As you say, this news does not reflect well upon the EU, so burying it behind strikes against austerity is the perfect approach...
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latipa
#13 Posted : 14 November 2012 22:31:28(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: richard Go to Quoted Post

Thus, the multi-annual framework agreement sets out the maximum figure, but each year the actual figure then has to be negotiated.


Wasn't the thing about annual budgets that they don't matter, since they can spend more than what is budgeted anyways.
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TheBoilingFrog
#14 Posted : 14 November 2012 23:25:05(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: richard Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: J A King Go to Quoted Post
Why are there 2 different budgets, an annual and a multi annual? I dont get it.
The only thing the multi annual one can be used for is to set the annual one, so if its been agreed in the multi annual one, then why would they discuss the annual?

Unless we have to pay into 2 different budgets?

I am really lost here, sorry if i am a little thick, but I really am lost.
any help with this most appreciated



Currently, the annual budget of 2013 is being negotiated, which includes a supplement for excess spending in 2012.

Separately, we have the 7-year multi-annual negotiations for 2014-202 ... the relationship is set out here:

"Annual EU budgets shall comply with the multiannual financial framework laid down in a unanimously adopted Council Regulation with a consent of the European Parliament. The financial framework sets the maximum amount of commitment appropriations in the EU budget each year for broad policy areas ("headings") and fixes an overall annual ceiling on payment and commitment appropriations."

Thus, the multi-annual framework agreement sets out the maximum figure, but each year the actual figure then has to be negotiated.




I know this probably doesn't work in practice, and forgive my ignorance on such matters, but does that theoretically mean if the EU uses all of the multi-annual budget in year one, there's no money left for the following six years (a sort of Genesis 41:20-30)?

Edit: ah re-reading it, I think I understand...

Edited by user 14 November 2012 23:33:06(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified
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J A King
#15 Posted : 15 November 2012 08:03:41(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: richard Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: J A King Go to Quoted Post
Why are there 2 different budgets, an annual and a multi annual? I dont get it.
The only thing the multi annual one can be used for is to set the annual one, so if its been agreed in the multi annual one, then why would they discuss the annual?

Unless we have to pay into 2 different budgets?

I am really lost here, sorry if i am a little thick, but I really am lost.
any help with this most appreciated



Currently, the annual budget of 2013 is being negotiated, which includes a supplement for excess spending in 2012.

Separately, we have the 7-year multi-annual negotiations for 2014-202 ... the relationship is set out here:

"Annual EU budgets shall comply with the multiannual financial framework laid down in a unanimously adopted Council Regulation with a consent of the European Parliament. The financial framework sets the maximum amount of commitment appropriations in the EU budget each year for broad policy areas ("headings") and fixes an overall annual ceiling on payment and commitment appropriations."

Thus, the multi-annual framework agreement sets out the maximum figure, but each year the actual figure then has to be negotiated.





Thanks very much Dr N, got it now :)
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